I understand the adapter dance - going from FireWire 400 to FireWire 800 to ThunderBolt 2 to Thunderbolt 3. But once there, can I plug that Thunderbolt 3 connection into a regular USB-C port? I believe USB-C is faster than FireWire 400 so transfer speed shouldn't be an issue.
I thought the cables for USB-C and offical ThunderBolt (with the lightening icon) were compatible and it was just that USB-C would not be as fast.
There is so much cost (the adapters) in moving to a smaller/faster/Win 11 PC, I'd like to avoid the cost of needing that newer/better/faster box to also support ThunderBolt if the USB-C will do?
Another concern is I see the miniPC's that say they have ThunderBolt but I only see a USB-C connection - no lightening icon. Maybe the lightening icon is just an Apple thing?
I have an old Intel box running Win 7 and a firewire card. But it's not going to run forever (neither am I). It will already cost over $100 just for that adapter chain. I could save about $200 on the MiniPC if that last ThunderBolt 2 to ThunderBolt 3 adapter could work with the USB-C port.
Is Thunderbolt necessary at the computer end?
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ke9ns
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Re: Is Thunderbolt necessary at the computer end?
As far as I am aware, nobody has created a USB3 to FireWire adapter. I do know they have a USB2 to FireWire device, but its only good for transferring photos across FireWire (DV) Sony cameras.
Even though Apple created a Thunderbolt to FireWire adapter, they dont make it anymore, so you would need to find a used or NOS unit.
But USB-C is only Thunderbolt if you see the thunderbolt logo next to it.
So the only current production would be a PCIe or mini-PCIe FireWire card (and use a M.2 adapter if needed)
Apple is definitely the biggest supporter of Thunderbolt (just like they were with FireWire back in the day)
Darrin
Even though Apple created a Thunderbolt to FireWire adapter, they dont make it anymore, so you would need to find a used or NOS unit.
But USB-C is only Thunderbolt if you see the thunderbolt logo next to it.
So the only current production would be a PCIe or mini-PCIe FireWire card (and use a M.2 adapter if needed)
Apple is definitely the biggest supporter of Thunderbolt (just like they were with FireWire back in the day)
Darrin
Creator of PowerSDR KE9NS v2.8, based on the Flex Radio PowerSDR v2.7.2 software.
Flex-5000, LDMOS and Titan Amps, G5RV, and Mosley TA-33 Junior
Flex-5000, LDMOS and Titan Amps, G5RV, and Mosley TA-33 Junior
Re: Is Thunderbolt necessary at the computer end?
Thank you Darrin, I just now saw the notification about my post here.
Yesterday I submitted another post asking about a different route.- using an external firewire enclosure. I've seen some that are firewire 400 to USB-C.There were also cheap firewire 400 to fireware 800 adapters.- if that's what the external enclosure needed.
Given my age, I could probably stockpile a few older Win7 slim profile desktop PC's that would last longer than me. It looks like an available firewire 400 driver for the newer PC OSs might become an issue too, if it hasn't already.
It's so paradoxical, it's funny. Flex sold these models with the "promise" that they'd never get obsolete. It's one thing to freeze the software, but it's another not to provide connection solutions - Can't they contract out to have a firewire 400 tp USB-C (even if it needs to be 3.2) cable available for their pre-Flex 6000 users?
Again, I'm puzzled why Thunderbolt keeps coming up when USB-C, even 3.1, specs faster data transfer then firewire 400. I must be missing something.
Yesterday I submitted another post asking about a different route.- using an external firewire enclosure. I've seen some that are firewire 400 to USB-C.There were also cheap firewire 400 to fireware 800 adapters.- if that's what the external enclosure needed.
Given my age, I could probably stockpile a few older Win7 slim profile desktop PC's that would last longer than me. It looks like an available firewire 400 driver for the newer PC OSs might become an issue too, if it hasn't already.
It's so paradoxical, it's funny. Flex sold these models with the "promise" that they'd never get obsolete. It's one thing to freeze the software, but it's another not to provide connection solutions - Can't they contract out to have a firewire 400 tp USB-C (even if it needs to be 3.2) cable available for their pre-Flex 6000 users?
Again, I'm puzzled why Thunderbolt keeps coming up when USB-C, even 3.1, specs faster data transfer then firewire 400. I must be missing something.
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ke9ns
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Re: Is Thunderbolt necessary at the computer end?
Thunderbolt used to have its own connector, but it didnt gain traction in the market place (apple was about the only one using it).
So when the USB-C connector came out, Intel decided to merge Thunderbolt3 hardware/software with the USB-C connector and USB hardware/software.
So all USB-C ports support USB, but do not support Thunderbolt unless specified (usually a Thunderbolt logo)
AND you need to beware of which USB-C cable you use. USB-C Thunderbolt cables the best but more expensive and will always function as a USB cable.
Most standard USB-C cables are not good enough to work over a Thunderbolt connection (most cables are not good enough for even 10gbps USB).
Longer Thunderbolt cables even have a computer chip molded into the ends of the cable to allow longer cables over 3' (expensive cables)
FireWire has its own connectors and Hardware/software.
At the time Flex decided to use FireWire, USB was not fast enough.
Many years later when USB finally was fast enough, support for FireWire dropped off.
Apple did make an adapter between the original Thunderbolt2 connector and FireWire.
I from what I have heard, it does work with the Flex-3000/5000
But I have been using my Flex-5000 on my Win11 pro Ryzen machine for 3 years with no issues
I have run my Flex-5000 on a Win11 Ryzen laptop, and a mini-PC Win11 Ryzen.
And yet some Win10-Win11 / FireWire Card combo's refuse to work properly?
I have found different FireWire cards that work and some that do not.
I cannot pin down why some work fine and others do not?
I do not have access to the FireWire source code, so I have no way to solve the mystery.
I do think its related to Microsoft security updates that occurred over the years between Win7 and Win11
Darrin
So when the USB-C connector came out, Intel decided to merge Thunderbolt3 hardware/software with the USB-C connector and USB hardware/software.
So all USB-C ports support USB, but do not support Thunderbolt unless specified (usually a Thunderbolt logo)
AND you need to beware of which USB-C cable you use. USB-C Thunderbolt cables the best but more expensive and will always function as a USB cable.
Most standard USB-C cables are not good enough to work over a Thunderbolt connection (most cables are not good enough for even 10gbps USB).
Longer Thunderbolt cables even have a computer chip molded into the ends of the cable to allow longer cables over 3' (expensive cables)
FireWire has its own connectors and Hardware/software.
At the time Flex decided to use FireWire, USB was not fast enough.
Many years later when USB finally was fast enough, support for FireWire dropped off.
Apple did make an adapter between the original Thunderbolt2 connector and FireWire.
I from what I have heard, it does work with the Flex-3000/5000
But I have been using my Flex-5000 on my Win11 pro Ryzen machine for 3 years with no issues
I have run my Flex-5000 on a Win11 Ryzen laptop, and a mini-PC Win11 Ryzen.
And yet some Win10-Win11 / FireWire Card combo's refuse to work properly?
I have found different FireWire cards that work and some that do not.
I cannot pin down why some work fine and others do not?
I do not have access to the FireWire source code, so I have no way to solve the mystery.
I do think its related to Microsoft security updates that occurred over the years between Win7 and Win11
Darrin
Creator of PowerSDR KE9NS v2.8, based on the Flex Radio PowerSDR v2.7.2 software.
Flex-5000, LDMOS and Titan Amps, G5RV, and Mosley TA-33 Junior
Flex-5000, LDMOS and Titan Amps, G5RV, and Mosley TA-33 Junior
Re: Is Thunderbolt necessary at the computer end?
Okay, I think I'm getting it. It's not that USB2 and above are faster than FireWire 400, it's that the adapter doesn't that that throughput. Light bulb goes on. 
So no matter what the speed of the USB port is, even the USB 3 family, it's that the adaptor isn't giving it the data at its spec'd out speed.
That now makes sense - the dawn breaks - If FireWire 400 is passing data to the adapter at 400mbps, the adapter can't give it to the next "person" in line any faster than it's getting it.
So no matter what the speed of the USB port is, even the USB 3 family, it's that the adaptor isn't giving it the data at its spec'd out speed.That now makes sense - the dawn breaks - If FireWire 400 is passing data to the adapter at 400mbps, the adapter can't give it to the next "person" in line any faster than it's getting it.